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This week, learn from a top social seller Jackie Richards about how to utilize social media in all the right ways. Leverage short form videos and apps like Instragram and TikTok without selling your soul to social. Listen in as Heather and Jackie discuss what a realistic view of residual income from a Network Marketing company looks like.

Episode Highlights:

・Learn from one of the top five Seint artists

・Hear Jackie’s story of how she went from hustling hard to working her business around her life

・If you are looking to build your business by leveraging social media this is how to do it the right way

・A lot of people confuse network marketing with being an influencer, what is the difference?

・How this can be duplicated by everyday women

・How to have realistic views of residual income as a network marketer 

・Anyone can do this, it’s hard but it’s simple

・How to leverage short form videos Aka Facebook, Instagram Reels and Tik Tok

・It’s less about niche and more about passion, purpose and storytelling

・Everyone has a passion purpose and a story, what’s yours?

Episode Resources/References:

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Jackie Richards Part 1:

Hey guys, and welcome back to the Scale Without Social podcast. So, I’m super excited for today’s interview. And this is going to be perfect if you fit in line with the 1, to 2, to 5, to 10%, that we’ve been talking about over the last few episodes that actually do want to build your business by essentially showing up like an online influencer. So yes, this is a small facet of the community that’s listening. But I think it’s an important conversation to help you make the decision that’s right for you and your business. Whether or not you want to leverage social media to build your business; or how much you want to leverage social media.

And today’s interview with Jackie Richards, who is a dear friend, a fellow top leader and honestly just a brilliant mind when it comes to doing “social selling” Or using the power of things like short form video on apps like Instagram or Tik TOK or Facebook to build your business.

Jackie does it the right way. So she’s sharing all her tips and her wisdom in the next two interviews. And in this week’s episode, we’re going to focus more on the tips of how to do it the right way along with sharing a little bit more of Jackie’s story of how she got to where she is. Which is leading a team of thousands and it being a top leader, a top earner within the industry. So can wait to see what you guys think!

Heather: Okay guys, I am seriously so excited to introduce you to the Jackie Richards, a dear friend of mine.

And if you don’t know, Jackie, she’s gonna share a little bit more about her story. But the wisdom that she’s gonna share for those of you guys who actually are looking to build your business, leveraging social media. So, if you’ve listened to the past few episodes, you guys are the ones who have that specific gifts and skill set to build a massive passive income, leveraging Instagram or even apps like TikTok. And Jackie is your go-to girl for helping you be able to do that in the right way. So she’s gonna be sharing both her experience and her story.

And Jackie, it is just such a blessing to have you here today. Thank you so much.

Jackie: I am so happy to be here. I am just, I love what you’re doing. I think it’s amazing. And I’m happy to share today about my experience in case it helps anyone.

Heather: Oh my gosh. Yay. Well, it’s, it’s seriously a thrill to be able to talk about this with you, because we are kind of coming from two different lenses on this. And that you definitely are tallking about your people and your amazing team that you have built with Seint. You’re one of the top five artists in the entire company, out of almost 30,000. That’s amazing. And I want you to share your story even prior to Seint. So tell me about where you’re from, your life growing up and what your life was like before you got into the business of network marketing.

Jackie: I love it. Okay. It’s just like a loaded question, but here we go. I come from a family of 10. We are like your classic Mormon family, lots and lots of kids and no step kids or anything like that. Grew up very poor. Obviously 10 kids. It was, things were very, very tight uncomfortable, all those things.

But we had a very loving family and we were very, very big on education. Like everyone, it was just like, hey, everyone’s gonna get an education. I attempted an education. I almost did all four years at a college. I didn’t get a degree or whatever, but I, I was always very driven because I always had it in my head education unlocks a key to poverty. That was just like drilled into my head. You have to get an education if you don’t want to live the life that we did.

And I ironically I didn’t get a full education. I, again, I have like almost four years done, but I do not have a degree. But I’ve always been of the mindset that I want to work. Like I just, I like working, I like feeling fulfilled.

And so I’ve always knew that that was kind of my path. Like even when I was a mom, I knew I wanted to work. So anyways, I discovered network marketing. Like most people do. You know, on Instagram scrolling Instagram. I saw, oh, people are doing stuff. I remember Beach Body, I think was my first, like, exposure to it.

And I was intrigued. I was definitely someone who did network marketing backwards. I actually would go to YouTube and I would look up compensation plans of other companies. And I would watch these trainings that other people would do from lots of other network marketing companies, like Arbonne, Beachbody. And I’m just soaking in the fact that these people are making a lot of money and I had not chosen a company. This was in 2016. But I was just like, almost just absorbing it all. Like, wow, this is remarkable. I remember I listened to Ray Higdon, like for months and months and months before I even had a company I was just like selling myself on the model.

So I’m very, very sold on social selling the model. And at multilevel marketing, all of it. And that was in 2016. I then joined what I call like my first husband. Everyone kinda has like a first husband network marketing company. OK. We were great, we were in love, but it was just not, it, it was not the thing.

So then in 2017, I did find Seint and have stayed married for five years and it is lovely and blissful. So yeah, that’s a little bit of like my upbringing into segue of social media. Do you care if I share a little bit about what it looked like? Maybe not social media, social selling, what it was like when I first got started and versus now?

Heather: Yes. I love that you started from a belief in the business model. Like that’s what made you decide to do it, but I know from your story and I can’t wait for you to share that you didn’t start, obviously, from where you are now.

Jackie: Totally. So. I hope we can get more into this, but a lot of people do confuse network marketing, this business model, with influencership. Meaning being famous on social media, being viral, being someone that is an absolute sensation. And can they go together? Absolutely. Sometimes they, they pair so nicely. And personally for me, I always wanted that, like, and hear that everyone listening. I always, I wanted to be an influencer paired with social selling. It just for me, the impact sounded huge.

And I wanted that impact. I crave, that’s very much so a part of why I do what I do. But with that being said, what’s really remarkable about this business model is you don’t have to be. So for three and a half years I built on, on Facebook. And I had built belly to belly. I, so in 2017, I joined Seint and I remember I posted in my local Las Vegas mom’s group.

I lived in Las Vegas at the time. And I was like, I’m looking to give makeovers, like, I don’t know anyone in this area. We were transplant from Idaho in this new, crazy big place. And I was like looking for makeovers. And I would meet women at parks, which I know sounds really dicey now. Like looking back, like, what was I doing? Taking my child to parks in Las Vegas. Giving makeovers in 90 degree weather. I don’t know, but I was very driven and I did that. I really don’t like, just to be clear, I don’t endorse that idea anymore, but that’s what I did.

Belly to belly work. And I did a lot of building on Facebook. Like I went live on my personal page and I was posting every single day. Not just about my product, but just like, hey, I’m showing up here in the workplace.

And so I was on Facebook a lot and I was doing belly to belly, like building connections. Just so everyone here is like, that can work really well. And it did work really well. So, I made some money that first year, and then I started to kind of notice within that first year, one of my leaders began kind of like partnering with other companies that, how do I describe L’ange? Affiliate.

Okay. Perfect. So, I’m very big on observing, what’s working for people that are making more than I am. Like, I love to kind of like observe, okay, this person is selling more than I am. This person is recruiting more than I am.

And so I would like success leaves clues. So I would go and observe. Okay, so my leader was really knocking it out of the park. One of my leaders I should say. And she was partnered with a hair company and they would provide sponsored ads for, for her. And so she’s like got this great personality and she’s just like so fun to watch on live video. But she partnered with a company that was able to like push her out into this algorithm.

And it was amazing. Like her sales were so reflective of this exposure. So that’s what I’m always very big on teaching is that you’re not low in sales. You’re low in exposures.

So I noticed that her exposures were just massive because she was being, you know, one she’s so fun to watch. So as is, she was gonna do great with her personal warm market. But she was being kind of almost given this gift of like, wow, you just got shoved out to millions of people through a sponsored ad because of this company.

So Heather. That is not necessarily super duplicatable, though. If we’re being honest, it’s something that is like wild, like, you know, that’s, that’s great, but like not all of us are gonna get like these partnerships with these companies that are gonna do that. So I still, like, I just put my head down though, and I was like, whatever, let’s just keep doing this.

The, the kind of not old fashioned way, but just like how network marketing goes. Like, let’s just keep show showing up on your social media and building those one-on-one connections. And who knows, like a Facebook party could change your business, et cetera, et cetera. Then fast forward to 2020 Instagram reels rolls out and I was already kind of loving TikTok, but I wasn’t ready to go all in on TikTok.

It felt like a lot, but I liked Instagram and I began working on Instagram reels. And at what I’ve found and what I love so much about the short form video of Instagram reels is that it took that special scenario of partnering with a company that was like, what almost felt lucky. I don’t wanna discredit people’s work, but, like, you know, like, oh wow, like they chose you to be their sponsored ad. And, all of a sudden it’s for everyone. Like people can grab onto short form video. And I see numbers in my team now that I’m like, who are you? Like you are from nowhere land and you are selling X, Y, Z. And it’s like, and that’s because they’re grabbing onto the gift of short form video.

So I’m such a fan of short form video, AKA Instagram reels, Facebook reels, and TikTok because it absolutely changed the game. And I watched it do the same for me when I grabbed hold of it in 2020. So prior to that, no, I was a, nobody. I was just really big on building connections and still building up exposures within what I had control of, which was my own personal live video and all those things.

But I just, I love how now with short form video, a lot of us have a shot. Being our own sponsored ad, like getting you want, you wanna reach millions? Like you have that it’s for free now on Instagram reels. And does it happen every time? No, but you have a really good shot at it. So that’s my little spiel.

Heather: I love it. And so, you know, for you, you see it as the something like partnering with a company, like L’ange. Which again, we’ve talked about, you know, on here people are probably familiar with that, which is an affiliate company. I mean you can’t sign somebody else up or you can’t even sign yourself up. You have to be kind of selected or approved to do it.

Whereas the same concept that can help build someone’s exposures, which I love that word. Which is essentially what leads to connections. So it’s exact same. You know, the end result is connecting with the people that you’re exposed to. So what it does, what short form video does, is it just increases your exposure.

And so for you, you now obviously believe and have not only believe, but have seen that duplicate onto your team with everyday real life girls.

Jackie: I mean, Heather, like I just, the numbers that we saw three years ago out of like, take the top 10 that we usually would see. I mean, you know who they are like those, those gals.

And I love ’em like, they’re, they’re like my bestie. Like I’ve looked up to them for years I still do. But I am, my jaw is still on the ground when I look at girls on my team and I’m like, I don’t even know who you are, but you’re holding a candle to what they did that used to feel so untouchable. And I just feel like, I’m just like, yay, yay for you for taking a chance on short form video!

Like, you didn’t get like, there’s nothing like they didn’t come in with extreme relationship equity. They weren’t influencers before. They’re just people that were like… so we go hard on my team with short form video. Which I know is like, you know, contradictive, you guys like Heather here is like without social media and I love it, but I equally am so fascinated with the option we have for free social media to build our business.

Heather: I love it. That’s what’s really cool about your story is that you have seen it duplicate with the everyday woman. I wanted to touch on episode 14. I did a reason that when people sometimes hear about others selling like hundreds of thousands of dollars of makeup, or, you know, these top sellers. They can start to get that FOMO or feel like they have to do all the same things and post three reels a day.

And, you know, do all of, all of the work that, the hard work that those people are doing to achieve those results.

And certainly, you and I know that that’s not always necessarily the case for having to build a long term residual income. You don’t have to sell a hundred thousand dollars basically, right?

Let’s talk about that. Cause I feel like some people, when they see like some of the results they are having, they say $2,000 in sales, which for us would still be in the top 5% of the entire company.


Jackie: Wait hard pause, like hard pause.

Like everyone hear that if you are selling that. Top 5%. That’s remarkable. I feel like you should pat yourself on the back if you’re a social seller and you’ve touched that, like that is great. Okay. Keep going.

Heather: No, I love that you said that because whether someone is choosing to build their business on, you know, as a social seller, meaning they are…

Well, actually, I would love for you to define social selling specifically too.

Before we get into that, whether or not they’re doing that, if you’re having those kinds of results, you are experiancing amazing life changing income and impact potential without having to have those crazy results, which are always gonna be a small, a small few.

Jackie: Yeah, I’ll define it, but I do, I do just wanna say, it’s not sexy. It’s not a top seller board. It’s not something that’s gonna get you a ton of attention or like roses from your upline, you selling $2,000 a month.

But that is why this industry is remarkable is so amazing is because if that fast forwarded by 10, five years or three to five years, whatever it may be like you keep up with that. Maybe like one recruit a month, $2,000 every single month. I’m sorry, but that is what will change. Like that can be super sexy in three to five years.

So I, as much as, you know, engram threes or my high achieving people listening to this, want to be in, you know, the top 10, or how do I bust into, you know, over $10,000 a month in sales. Like, you know, go for it or whatever, but please note that that’s not what this is. That’s why, wow. There’s so many rabbit holes with this, but that’s why network marketing that’s why I did personally choose this over, just being a blogger or an influencer. So I know I said I wanted, I wanted that. I, I do. I want to pull in influencer-ship with being a network marketer, but that’s because network marketing is so inclusive. Like the, the bar is really low in terms of like, anyone can do this.

Like it’s, I’m not, we’re not asking people to be something like famous or anything like that. So these $2,000 a month in sales is like so cool, because that really is the sauce. Like that consistency will change your business. So anyways, that’s my little thought on there, but social seller versus network marketer.

I’ll be honest. You were the one who opened my eyes to it. When you, we talked in January about this. And I took a picture of it and I showed it to my team of the differences. But I really do feel like a social seller is someone who is utilizing social media to almost grow that influence. It is for a lot of people that want to, I guess, they’re up for the challenge of it being almost strictly social media. Whereas, which for some people, a lot of millennials, they love it.

Like gen Z coming up. Like that is their cup of tea. They would rather like croak over than ask their mom to host a Facebook event or something like that. You know, and if that is someone that you’re like, I just don’t want to, like, I want to build from nothing. It is going to be hard, but it is so doable and it is like a total option.

But then there’s, you know, network marketers, which I feel like is a lot of what I, I truly did exemplify my first three and a half years of doing this. Which was, going to parks and meeting people and being like, "hi, I’m Jackie," or you know, someone like I would just, I would join mom groups and just build up my relationship equity and I would go live almost every single day.

Like, I was trying to actually just work on that more one-on-one connection. Whereas so like social selling’s a little bit more like you’re, you’re almost I don’t, I wouldn’t say everyone’s trying to be an influencer, but it is edging closer towards that than the belly to belly, one-on-one connection. I don’t know.

Am I off on that?

Heather: No, I totally, I totally agree. And I think one of the biggest things and a lot of the strategies that you teach are focused on building a following on social media. So you’re focused on things like nicheing down, right? And we can talk about, you know, specific tips, but really, really going in to treat social media as it’s a business, not as a platform where you’re just sharing your life with your friends and family, right? This is you’re bringing on new people, connecting with more and more and building, building growth in that way. And then using those connections or exposures, like you said, to create conversion for your business.

Jackie: And I think both are hard.

I feel like both are, it’s kind of like choose your hard. Which we kind of talked about that before this. It’s like, you know, it’s like, either way, this industry is not, it’s simple, it’s not easy.

Heather: Yeah.

Jackie: Like it’s a very simple thing that’s going on here, but it is going to be hard knocks and lots of whether you’re going to meet someone at a park and share your product or whatever, or you’re going to go the route of social selling.

And you must know that it’s a lonely route for a while. Unless you are a unicorn personality and you’re a magnanimous, you know, character and people just flock to you. So yeah, you kind of gotta pick your hard.

Heather: Yeah, I love that you said that pick you’re hard. Because, and I think it is a little bit generational dependent, and I’m glad that you touched on that with, you know, the upcoming gen Z.

I think that that’s, what’s attracting them to the network marketing or social selling industry is the fact that they can use the things that they’ve grown up with. Right? Like they’ve been doing the TikTok dances and they’ve been, they feel comfortable doing their makeup on a video. Whereas, if you think about like the older generations, like, especially like 50 plus, I would say. They’re the ones who are terrified to go live or terrified to, but they’ll pick up the phone and call someone or they’ll talk to their banker about their business, right?

Or they’ll, you know, they’ll do in person makeovers all day. So I think it is, it is a little bit of a generational difference and it’s so important to be able to serve all the facets of how to do this business.

And you’re right. It’s not, it’s not easy. But it is simple.

Jackie: Yeah. It is simple. Yeah.

But it’s all inclusive. It really is. Like, I feel like, you know, that’s why network marketing is so cool. Is that it can take someone with maybe little to no skillset and be like, let’s pick a spot and go

Heather: Amen to that. So you really dove in, you said it was in 2020, right? When, when Instagram came out with reels, you kind of shifted your business focused to go hard on Instagram. And it has really paid off for you and you built an incredible, massive following that’s still growing to this day.

Not just with customers who are coming to you for the makeup, but they’re coming to you for advice on how to build their own social media business, which is really exciting. So what is, what does that journey look like for you and cuz I know you had to learn to, you know, kinda learn out loud, even in a lot of ways, right?

It’s not like you were automatically an expert in that field. So walk us through that journey and then maybe what it’s looked like recently for you.

Jackie: Yeah. So, I mean, I guess I just had always heard from podcast after podcast, after, you know, training, after training, you know, serve your audience, serve your audience, serve your audience.

And I just. I don’t know. I, it didn’t really click. Like I thought I was serving when I was doing my makeup tutorials in 2019 and 2018. Like I was like, I’m serving, you know, but I don’t know. This one makes me a little uncomfortable because it, it forces me to realize that maybe I’m not great at makeup.

And, but I am great at sharing value in other areas. So to anyone listening, I absolutely love my company’s product. I use it every day and I think it absolutely solves a problem. But, when it comes down to growing, I think you have to leverage true passion. And I have like this insane, true passion for, like, normalizing success for women online. And I want people to come to me for that. And I can show, I feel like my reels where I’m like giving value with social media maybe hold a little bit more water. But that could be a limiting belief, I don’t know. I’ll find out when I listen to Bob’s podcast next.

I’m not sure, but I just feel like it’s, and so for me it works. I just kind of just do 50/50 at like every two reels I’ll do on, you know, giving tips on Instagram or social selling, and then I’ll do some makeup stuff. Cuz I’m not gonna ever sit down and stop sharing makeup stuff, like I love it. But I just feel like I, people can feel my real, like the insane passion with my other content and then they trust me more.

So whenever you serve someone, whenever you give value. People remember that, like when you’re helpful, people remember that. And it creates a feeling, it creates an emotion for them. And then, so it just bleeds into everything else. So yeah, I sell quite a bit of makeup because of my value I give on Instagram, but I also sell, you know, quite a bit of the earrings I love. Quite a bit of the hair, you know, products I love. And so that’s what I really do try and teach to anyone in any facet of network marketing that’s showing up online. Is that give value, be valuable and people will trust you. Like, they’ll be like, okay, what else, what else you got for me?

Laundry detergent next, like I’m, I’m down. Like, you know what I mean? Like, so I just, I found that true meaning of service in my content did lead to sales. But. Yeah. It’s I know it’s gonna hang up a lot of the listeners because they’ll be like, what’s my value. What’s my value.

Heather: Yeah. What’s your niche.

Jackie: Yeah.

And I, and honestly, I’m glad you’re bringing up the word niche because I’ve actually had this huge shift in how I feel about it.

I haven’t publicly like really shared about it on Instagram. Cause it’s such a hot topic right now.

Heather: Totally.

Jackie: That you need a niche. And personally, like, I feel like I was, this is gonna sound bad, I felt like I was that mom that made her teenage daughter feel fat. Because of the pressures I used with niche. Because I, I really did see for me, it worked, I had a niche y’all and I freaking saw it reflecting on my back office. I was getting new followers.

And so I would go to my team and I’d be like, yo, we gotta get a niche. This is the way it is. And. I think that that’s what I mean when I say it was a little bit toxic, it was like the mom making her kids feel like they needed a diet. And I, I’ve, since it’s been two years since I went down that path and I’ve realized it wasn’t necessarily niche.

I’m sorry. I know Brock Johnson was featured on this podcast. I know there’s a lot of other experts listening, but I have found what I think actually it is, is passion, purpose, storytelling. Is what really drives up views, followers, trust. Value is all of those things. So your value doesn’t have to be, I give tips on how to make easy family meals, you know. And I’m just gonna go hard in the direction of like 30 posts, about easy family meals on my social media.

It really is like, what lights you up? It’s the passion. And again, you could kind of see like, even like, as you’re watching me on the zoom, like I light up when I’m like on social media. Like, it really is this like thing that lights me up and it wasn’t necessarily the niche, it was passion. And that is duplicatable.

Every person listening has passion, purpose and a story. And then everyone can, you can take like, let the weight fall off. You don’t necessarily have to have this said niche on Instagram to succeed. I think it’s just leaning into who, you know, you are. And I think you can refine it over time and it gets, it slowly becomes to be whittled down a little bit more to niche or whatever we’re gonna call it. But, I hate using it now though, I found, Heather, it was paralyzing. It paralyzed my team.

Heather: Yes.

Jackie: And that was the worst. So.

Heather: Oh my gosh, I love, I love that you clarified that. Cuz I actually, do you think that, that simplification and really diving down to what makes you, you, and then leveraging, if you choose, social media to share that passion. That’s, what’s gonna make people come to you and build that trust.

That’s gonna, you know, when you share, like you said, whatever it is, they will come for that, that value. And I think that actually is, it’s such a more duplicatable thing than really just going all in on a thing.

Jackie: People have found. That they went, like, I saw it in my own team. Like they were like, I did it. Like, and they would, oh my gosh, like I would scroll their feed and it was impeccable. And it was like people being on a diet and checking all the dang boxes. But there was no soul. There was no. There was no passion in it. There was no humanness. And that’s, I feel like I’ve tried to like, kind of say that. And in some ways I did last year. When I was like, in my height, my peak of growing. Like, I was like, be a human, but like have a niche.

But it’s like, no wait, I think it really is. Just be a human. And that’s where we find, in network marketing that, you know, there’s some people that are million dollar earners with a following of like a thousand people.

Heather: Yeah.

Jackie: Like, you know, there are people… and it’s because they’re very good at telling their story and being passionate.

And when they pick the phone up and they call someone, they can feel it. And that’s, what’s selling. It’s not always like this impeccable feed and this perfectness and the niche that’s on point. It’s the passion and purpose and storytelling behind network marketers.

Heather: I love that.

And two additional things that, as you were sharing your story with that, that kind of came to my mind.

And speaking of Bob Heilig, which his episode aired right before this, which is I can’t wait to hear what he has to say about this. But basically he, I know he would say that anything that creates, he calls it growth oriented action in yourself. So like, if you are, if something does kind of scare you, you have to lean into the hard to your hard, that that is something that you should, you know, lean into basically and leverage for your business.

But then he also talks about, and this is something I learned from him. That people don’t always do what you tell them to do. They do what they see you do. So I think the fact that you’re teaching people how to build your business on social media, by showing them how you build your business on social media.

I feel like that is an another important principle when it comes to traditional network marketing and things like duplication. Is people can duplicate what it is that you’re doing. They absolutely can, they can show up and share passionate short firm videos about the stories and the things that they’re going through in their lives or the things that they love.

So I think, I know Bob would feel proud – definitely a gold star for you, Jackie.

Yeah. Okay. So I know this is a little bit of a cliffhanger ending, and I know you are dying to hear more from Jackie Richards, but we are going to share the rest of this interview next week, where we tackle some really tough , topics like burnout, in particular. So Jackie’s going to continue sharing her wisdom for those of you guys who are just pursuing all facets of how this integration of social media, or as Bob Heilig calls it, marketing with your selling business. And how to do it the right way. So I can’t wait for next week and can’t wait to hear what you guys think about this week’s episode.

So make sure to head on over to the Scale Without Social for female entrepreneurs group on Telegram. You can search it right up in the Telegram app. Or you can text the word podcast to 9124058912. And again I’m so excited for you guys to continue the conversation over there and I’m happy to help you all with anything you need!

Have a great week!

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